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[interviews with Ray McGovern]

[firsthand account from one of the disrupters]

5/4/06: Rumsfeld's speech at the Southern Center for International Studies in Atlanta today was disrupted by World Can't Wait activists and others.  At the beginning of the speech a woman stood up holding a banner reading "Guilty of War Crimes!", and shouted "I cannot stay silent, this man needs to be in prison for war crimes" as she was dragged away by security.  Two more protesters stood up and disrupted the speech, and another turned his back on his back on Rumsfeld.

During the Q&A, Ray McGovern (a former CIA analyst who recently returned his intelligence medal to Congress in protest of torture) asked Rumsfeld "Why did you lie to get us into a war that caused these kind of casualties and was not necessary?"  Rumsfeld couldn't muster much of an answer besides claiming he didn't lie, which McGovern then refuted with a direct quote from Rumsfeld in the run-up to the Iraq war.  A woman whose son was killed in the Iraq war also asked Rumsfeld whether the government would provide any help for her grandson.

In his speech, Rumsfeld talked about building "flexible military partnerships" around the world outside of NATO (translation: ally with regimes known to openly practice torture and human rights abuses).  When he was disrupted, Rumsfeld arrogantly joked (referring to the protester), "I think we can count her as undecided".  Besides being disgusting, this comment from Rumsfeld is also unoriginal - it's the same thing he said when he was disrupted by another World Can't Wait activist at the National Press Club in February.

What happened in Atlanta today is an example many more need to follow.  CNN reported that while the Bush regime is coming under more fire in their public appearances (including in Rice's much disrupted recent visits to England, Australia, and Greece), this outbust was "beyond the usual".  As retired generals are calling for Rumsfeld's resignation and government sponsored torture becomes more exposed, the protests against Rumsfeld were right on time.  The actions today should serve as a clarion call to others that anywhere the architects of torture and unjust war go, they should be called out for their war crimes.

(Read CNN's report)

A firsthand account:

Today was a fine day in Atlanta, although I doubt that Donald Rumsfeld feels the same way.  He was asked to come speak here today at the Atlanta History Center by the Southern Center for International Studies and it was open to the public for $40.00 a ticket.  Several of us decided to attend the event to let him and the world know what we think of him. So several minutes into his speech an activist with World Can't Wait Atlanta stood up, unfolded a banner that said 'Guilty of War Crimes' as she screamed, 'I cannot be silent, this man should be in prison for his war crimes and crimes against humanity.  He personally ordered widespread torture, an illegal and immoral war in Iraq, and is now planning a nuclear war on Iran.  We in the millions need to stop these crimes and Drive Out the Bush Regime, The World Can't Wait!'  As she was escorted out of the venue, she continued to scream 'The World Can't Wait - Drive Out the Bush Regime!'  Donald Rumsfeld responded with his usual line after she was removed, ' I guess she is undecided.'  She was handcuffed and told that she would be detained until they were told if Rumsfeld wanted to press charges.

As he continued his speech, another protester, a local peace activist, stood up and turned his back on Rumsfeld. He was not removed from the room and kept standing through the rest of the speech. He had a big sticker on his jacket 'Impeach Bush' on the background of a Georgia peach. Rumsfeld continued his speech as the protester stood with his back turned.  A few minutes later, another local peace activist stood up with a banner that read 'Rumsfeld is a Serial Liar,' and she began to scream 'you lied to the American people, you lied about WMDs, you lied about the Iraqi nuclear program,' as she was removed from the venue.   And then just as they thought every thing was back on track, a youth with the World Can't Wait Atlanta got up and shouted 'How can y'all sit here silent when you have a war criminal in front of you?' As he was escorted out, he turned to the stage and said, 'You are a war criminal, Mr. Rumsfeld.' All three of us who were removed from the venue were temporarily detained then escorted off the property.

Ray McGovern, who is an ex-CIA analyst who participated in the Bush Crimes Commission, was in town this week to receive an award from the ACLU.  He was able to get a ticket and participated in the Q&A after Rumsfeld's speech.  He asked Rumsfeld about his lying about the WMD to get the backing of the public to go to war with Iraq.  Rumsfeld basically blamed the lies on Bush and Colin Powell, and tried to doubletalk his way around the accusations. Ray McGovern kept pressing and wouldn't let Rumsfeld wiggle out.

Before, during and after the event there was also a demonstration outside in front of the Atlanta History Center.  About 50 people attended, some people wore the orange jumpsuits with black hoods.  They were very visible on a busy street with many cars showing support.  There was a lot of local media coverage.

All night the news shows have covered the multifaceted expressions of opposition during Rumsfeld's visit. Our actions today were very successful in that we were able to change the terms of debate from whether Rumsfeld was incompetent, didn't send enough troops to Iraq, didn't plan for the occupation, etc. to whether he is guilty of war crimes and whether he and the Bush administration lied to justify the war.

A mock flyer was passed out to those attending Rumsfeld's speech, which in part read:

Today's event includes a presentation by the Secretary, followed by Q & A. If you plan to ask the Secretary a question, please adhere to the following guidelines:

1.  Refrain from using the word 'liar' in relation to the war in Iraq.

2.  Do not question the Secretary's personal responsibility for the torture of prisoners in Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib, or elsewhere.

3.  No discussion of plans for first use of nuclear weapons against Iran will be allowed.

If you violate these guidelines, you will be immediately removed from the auditorium, flown to an undesignated prison location somewhere in Eastern Europe, and tortured. Thank you for your cooperation.

Interviews with Ray McGovern:

Democracy Now Interview with Ray McGovern

5/5/06: Democracy Now opened this morning with the disruption of Rumsfeld's speech by WCW activists, and a subsequent exchange with Ray McGovern and Rumsfeld. DN interviewed Ray McGovern:
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/05/05/1432203

Ray: And I suppose the good news is that finally someone had a chance to ask Don Rumsfeld -- if I were in Washington, I never would have got into a session where Rumsfeld spoke. I have to give him credit that he took questions and answers. But, you know, it's really interesting that when I walked into the place, I wrangled a ticket very surreptitiously. I was met with this little blurb on Donald Rumsfeld, and as I read it, I had to chuckle. It says, "There's going to be a question-and-answer period, but please adhere to these guidelines. Refrain from using the word 'lie' in relation to the war in Iraq. Do not question the secretary's personal responsibility for torture. And please don't discuss first use of nuclear weapons against Iran. If you violate these guidelines, you'll be immediately removed from the auditorium, flown to an undesignated prison location somewhere in Eastern Europe and tortured. Thank you for your cooperation. The World Can't Wait." A wonderful, wonderful group. Those were the folks that spoke up and tried to brace Donald Rumsfeld with the lies and their charges of him being -- and he is, arguably -- a war criminal. And we shouldn't shy away from saying that."

Transcript of CNN Interview (by Paula Zahn) with Ray McGovern:

ZAHN: Did you go to this speech today with the intent of challenging Secretary Rumsfeld?

MCGOVERN: I had no predetermined objectives. I just wanted to see what he had to say. But I did get very motivated when the first lady was ejected ... from the crowd.

ZAHN: What was it, then, that you wanted to accomplish by following her rather pointed question?

MCGOVERN: Well, you know, she talked about lies. And I get very upset when Donald Rumsfeld shakes his head and says, "Lies, gosh, lies. I hate it when somebody says that our president would tell lies."

Of course, she hadn't said the president; she said Rumsfeld. But he said that lies are fundamentally destructive of the trust, without which government cannot work.

And that's true. And I found myself really agreeing with that.

ZAHN: Essentially, what he told you is: I never said exactly where the weapons of mass destruction were. I was referring to, we had a pretty darn good idea where the sites were. ... Do you buy what he said today?

MCGOVERN: His words [in 2003] were: "We know where -- where the WMD are. They're near Tikrit and Baghdad, and north, south, east, and west of there." That's a direct quote.

And when he used that wonderful non sequitur by looking at the uniformed personnel in the front row and saying: "Well, they went in with protective gear; they certainly thought there were weapons of mass destruction there." Well, my goodness, of course, they did. Because you, Donald Rumsfeld, told them that they were there.

And, you know, it's not polite to say this, but that was a bald-faced lie. And ... he should have owned up to it, if he wants there to be a modicum of trust.

ZAHN: How much of an ax do you have to grind with Secretary Rumsfeld?

MCGOVERN: It's not a matter of axes to grind. It's a matter of telling the truth.

And we pledged, in my day at the CIA, to tell it without fear or favor, to tell it like it is. And, when I see that corrupted, that is the real tragedy of this whole business.

ZAHN: There was a point where it appeared as though you were going to get kicked out.

MCGOVERN: Yes.

ZAHN: Donald Rumsfeld encouraged whoever I think had their hands on you at the time to let you stay there. Does he get any credit for that today?

MCGOVERN: At first, I thought, "Well, that was rather gracious."

But, then I got to thinking, I was not abusing the privilege. I was simply asking pointed questions. And for the national TV audience to see me carted away for asking Rumsfeld to explain what any objective observer would call a lie, that wouldn't have been good PR.

So, yes, I'm glad he let me stay. But I think it was for self-interested reasons.

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